Stand Up Paddle Surfing 101(updated)
Jul 27th, 2007 by billb
This is a collaborative document. Please add your comments to this posting
The updated version of this document is at www.kenalu.com , we’re publishing it there in book form. You’ll also find a lot of how-to articles on Ke Nalu, which is still a blog, but has a more magazine-like format and a lot more articles and features.
If you’re beginning stand up surfing then I suspect you’ll find this very helpful. There are several other postings that are almost as useful. I have changed the posting dates so they all appear first.
To all of you regular commenters–if you register I’ll set you up with full posting rights–you can edit this document, add pictures and video, create your own posts and pages, etc.
The idea is to build a collaborative document that will reflect the knowledge of anyone that has something to contribute. I’d like to include your perspectives. They don’t have to carefully written, just informative. I’ll edit and polish to make the document readable. I’ll also keep changing the timestamp to move it to the top as I make changes.
You don’t have to register to post comments–though I would be nice so I know who to credit.
This article is built in five major sections with dozens of subsections:
- Introduction–cautions and precautions
- Etiquette
- Gear–Available boards and why you would choose them
- Board Tests
- Board Theory
- Paddle tests
- Paddle Theory
- Building a Wood Paddle
- Adding handles and tie downs
- Getting up–Standing on your board, paddling, balance, turning techniques
- Standing
- Turning
- Distance Paddling
- Board Trimming
- Paddling technique
- Surfing–How to catch waves and some techniques for riding them
We’ll add more sections and/or subdivide those sections as necessary. Let’s start.
In just three short weeks you can stand up surf like this!! Yeah, right.
Giampaolo gets the BEST photos–and he does it with just a point and shoot camera. His blog is a daily imperative. This is Laird Hamilton on a whacky Ho’okipa wave in howling Kona winds. Photo courtesy of MauiSurf/windsurf forecast, Giampaolo Cammarota
I am wildly underqualified to instruct anyone on Stand Up Paddle (SUP) Surfing. I’m a beginner–a little ahead of you if you start today. (Note: The updated version of this document is at www.kenalu.com.) That’s exactly why a beginner may find this very valuable–you’re going to have the same problems I do. some of the people that add information to this document are extremely well qualified, and so even advanced surfers and SUP wizards may find value.
Introduction–Cautions and Precautions
Special thanks to Blane Chambers at Paddle Surf Hawaii for reminding me I needed to add this section. Blane has very useful sections on his website with instruction in both basic and advanced technique.
Before you start paddle surfing you need to assess your swimming skills and your ability to handle yourself and your board in surf. Any watersport is dangerous, and good swimming skills are a necessity, even if you only do standup on flat water and lakes.
Leash: Your choice of leash or no leash is personal, and depends on whether or not you think you’re better off tied to a twelve foot board in the surf. Personally, I wear them. Even on a lake. When you fall you often give the board a kick that sends it zooming away. Then the substantial freeboard gives the wind something to push against and suddenly you’re all alone. In waves it’s even easier to be abandoned by your board. I had to swim in from the outer reef at Kanaha when my leash parted one morning last summer. It was after noon before I hit sand. Long morning.
Lifejacket: It’s not unreasonable to wear kayak-style lifejacket. The inflatable kind that are almost as narrow as a pair of suspenders are really handy. Some of the best big wave surfers in the world wear them today. Yes, you’ll look stupid, but you’ll be alive and stupid, not dead and cool.
Be aware of the wind and currents, you can easily be blown to sea by an offshore wind or find yourself fighting a powerful current. Start your learning experiences where there are lifeguards, and it’s highly recommended to have someone on the shore that’s paying attention to where you are and whether you are screaming or not.
When you are beginning, stay away from other surfers. These are big boards and it’s easy for them to get out of control. You don’t need the best spot in the lineup, all you need is some sloppy waves to practice on.
Etiquette: Once you are good, remember that you have a huge advantage over other surfers–and DON’T take more advantage of it than you should. You can start into a wave long before standard surfers can, you can get back to the lineup much quicker, and you can catch waves even when you’re out of the slot. Don’t be a wave hog.
A little more on hogging waves–there’s a backlash starting of surfers being pissed off about SUP folks coming into their favorite spot and taking too many waves. Of course for some of the territorial knuckleheads that think they own the beach, any wave is too many waves. But there’s two good reasons not to irritate fellow surfers–first of all, you don’t need their waves. A SUP surfer can surf almost anywhere. Waves that are too small for shortboarders are just fine for SUP. Long frequency, no shoulder waves give long and fulfilling rides. Cripes, you can SUP surf in a ski boat wake. You can also travel long distances to get to outside brakes or breaks that aren’t easy to get to from shore. It’s fun and good exercise getting there, and you don’t have to dodge the grems. And second, they were there first. No matter how stupidly they might assert their territory, you’re the new guy, even if you shortboarded the break for the last twenty years. Give them room.
Gear–Available boards and why you would choose them
The first issue is the right board. For a rank beginner there’s almost no such thing as too wide or too long. But once you start catching waves or riding in difficult conditions like chop and wind, you might outgrow your first board.
Here’s what Ron had to say on the subject: So I borrowed a board that is 11′X28″X4.75 thick and I’m thinking: This board is fricken HUGE. Wrong. It actually was quite a bit too small (I’m 6′3 and 225) and it gave me no end of grief. Tippy and really hard to control, and today I am one sore puppy from holding that lateral balance. What a great workout though.
Oh yeah and I love it.
But a suggestion. Make sure the first board you use is, if anything, way big for you. Not too small. First time out you won’t be doing any Laird moves anyway. Gotta figure out how to handle the damn thing first. Even for a long time surfer there is that paddle in there confusing things. Just getting used to that takes some work without having to contend with a hard to balance board. And make sure the paddle is long enough too. A short paddle makes you lean sideways, not good.
Anyway way maybe I’m just a total klutz but that’s my thought. The more you weigh, the bigger the board needs to be. I’m 6′3″ and weigh 240. My favorite board for purely getting up and paddling around is a Jimmy Lewis 11′ 0″ by 30″ wide. It’s thick and floaty, has a huge fin that adds stability, and it’s easy to get it moving. It’s an epoxy sandwich board so it’s very light. That’s good news when you’re moving this thing around.
I also really like the Ding King hollow board I waited about six months for. The Ding King has one mold for making these boards and they take about a week apiece. Last I heard Mark still had a long waiting list. Mark’s boards are 11′6″ and 27″ wide. They have a full length pad and they’re fairly stable considering the relatively narrow width. The two best things about this board are how it tracks and how it sails. It’s relatively easy to paddle this board fast and straight. I had a mast track put onto mine and I sail it more than I paddle it–it’s great fun to chase down a big wave and ride it until it poops out, then sail back to the reef and do it again.
I’ve also looked at the new Lairds, the largest of which makes my Jimmy Lewis boards look small (I think it’s 12′ 2″ by 31). They are hard to get right now, but I’ve got my name in for one. They’re being made in Asia somewhere so they should be widely available soon. I’d love one with a mast track, but I don’t think that will be happening soon. I was talking to a buddy of Laird Hamilton’s at the beach yesterday who quoted Laird as saying something like “I was the first guy (in recent history) to do standup, and the last to offer a board, but I want anything I put my name on to be absolutely right”. Everyone I’ve talked to loves these boards, but I haven’t tried one yet. Stay posted.
Most people I know say that JL board is still too small for me–that I need something around 12′ 6″ and 30 inches wide. Sounds good, but for now I’m happy. I finally figured out to surf this 11′0″, and I’m having a great time with it. this board is by far the easiest board to stand up on that I’ve tried. Even much larger boards are harder to keep your balamnce on–I don’t know what kind of mojo Jimmy added to the shape, but it’s working.
The new Starboard boards due out in april also sound very interesting (Update–I now have one of the Starboard 12′6″ boards on the road racing trip I’m taking around North America (www.allaluminumtour.com ) and it’s great for lake paddling–best cruiser I’ve tried yet. I’ll do a review asap). The Hot Sails Maui forum has some interesting details on this.
I also have a Jimmy Lewis 11′7″ x 26. I use this mostly as a regular surfboard–it’s fabulous in small surf. Now that I’m getting better at standup I can actually paddle this thing, but it’s very tippy, especially in side chop. I think it would make a fabulous SUP board for a small or skinny person, especially once they start catching waves. I’m not a good surfer yet, but I can actually shuffle my way to the nose with this board.
Another good choice is a big softop. The bigger the better. But don’t buy one unless it’s seriously cheap, you’ll outgrow it quickly. These are probably the only stand up boards you can rent.
Here’s what Juanita K says about choosing a board for the kind of paddling you plan to do: My husband and I bought 2 SUP boards late last year (made at Burleigh Heads) and we are just about to buy 2 more. Why? Coz we have learnt over the last 6 months that our boards (coolite…like a true paddleboard, 12ft long, 4-41/2 thick, 28″ wide) are perfect for smooth glide and flat water paddling or riding bumps and doing downwinds (which is fine coz in Hervey Bay where we live there is no surf). But, the problem is that when we take these boards surfing, they are way too corky and the rails are just too thick. So…you need to work out if your board is for paddling and surfing OR for surfing and paddling.
Over last weekend, we have some friends at Noosa who kindly let us try their SUP boards and it is amazing how much better theirs surf…BUT…when I took one on a sightseeing paddle around to National Park, our boards gliiiiiide so much better and you can feel so much less resistance on each stroke, coz it feels like they are slipping over the water, rather than ploughing slightly through it. So we are doing a lot of research and asking heaps of questions of a few very good SUP boarders up on the Sunshine Coast, so that we get the specs right for surfing, not so much paddling.
All the best in your hunt and welcome to the SUP fraternity on the east coast of Oz
Hey, Jaunita, thanks for the comments. I’m working with some friends on Maui to build a board that’s right for both surfing and cruising. I don’t think the two need to be mutually exclusive, in fact I think they both demand the same things of the board. What might be impossible is to combine good surfing and cruising into a BEGINNER board.
For example, the Ku Nalu board is the best cruiser I’ve tried–it seems like a single stroke carries you yards and yards, while the JL 11er feels like you travel the length of the stroke and not an inch further. It’s also not the best surfing board. But it’s amazingly stable, maneuverable and a decent surfer. The Ku Nalu is an excellent surfer, it’s nearly as good as the magical JL 11′7″.
So what we’re trying to do is borrow a little stability from the general outline of the JL 11er (but a bit narrower) with the cruising ability of the Ku Nalu in the bottom and rails. The result should be an intermediate board. If it works out well go into limited production.
If you’re buying a board, see if you can get a mast track put into it. Not only will that open a new set of doors (longboard windsurfing) it also makes the board a lot easier to handle. Get whoever puts the mast track in to route some fingerholes in the track at one end. You can still use it to hold a mast base, but you can also stick your fingers in to carry the board. These boards are too wide to tuck under an arm.
Boards with a rubber deck are great for foot grip, but when you’re first learning you’ll spend a lot of time on your knees. The deck is very grippy and can wear holes in your knees. Wax on an undecked board won’t do that. Take a look at my knees sometime–I’ll have the scars for years. I went to the drugstore and got some neoprene knee braces–solved the problem, though you look like a dork. But you’re going to look like a dork for a while anyway, no harm done. You should still wax the rubber deck–makes it much sticker. Just like the boogie boarders wax their soft boards (I didn’t know that trick until recently, I always wondered how those guys kept the boards under them when they swim).
Waxing a board without a deck pad works just fine–for awhile. The problem is that SUP surfers stand in one place a lot longer than surfers do, and the wax gets squeezed away from exactly the places you need it most. Still, you don’t NEED a deck pad, they’re just handy.
Paddles: Then you need a paddle. Two choices generally available, wood or carbon fibre. I’ve seen a few aluminum shafted paddles, but haven’t found any for sale. Carbon fibre is about half the weight and twice the price–about $300. You need a paddle that’s about one shaka above your head–six inches taller than you. Wood paddles are considered better for learning since you’re supposedly less likely to break them. But I’ve found the carbon fibre to be very forgiving and I like to think they’re less of a deadly weapon when you’re flailing them about. In either case, put a layer of duct tape around the paddle edge to cushion it. When you fall you’ll be whacking the board with your paddle edge. Do it a little hard and you’ll knock a chip out of the board. Don’t ask how I know this. You can take the tape off later when you stop falling every thirty seconds. I have two paddles and I like both of them, one is a Pohaku Beachboy paddle, and I don’t know the source of the second one–I’ll dig into that.
Another gear question: Bootie or no bootie. For the first few weeks I think it’s a really good idea to have booties. You’ll be falling in all kinds of crazy positions. Landing on the coral without booties is not fun. I like the O’Neill Superfreak split toe tropicals . They seem to affect your balance less than solid foot booties. While I’m delivering unsolicited plugs, the O’Neill Superfreak board shorts are the best board shorts I’ve ever had–spendy, but worth it. The O’Neill website is pretty cool, though they desperately need a writer who doesn’t just babble corp-speak. Could use a proofreader too, but so could I.
I don’t know why all the stuff I really like lately is named superfreak. Maui Hot sails Superfreak windsurfing sails, superfreak booties, superfreak board shorts. Someone may be trying to tell me something.
Enough gear chat, let’s get in the water.
Carrying your gear
These boards are huge, so carrying them around and getting them in the water can be a challenge in itself. If you’re in heavy shorebreak doing it wrong can be dangerous.
Thanks to Wardog from SurfingSports.com for this section of tips and modifications to make handling your gear easier.
I’ve written about some of these issues on other posts…doesn’t hurt to reiterate here…
Bill, may even want to integrate this into his Standup 101 page…
This first tip is actually for longboard sailing, but since many standup paddlers also get mast track on their boards, it’s a good tip for this section as well. My first recommendation, for difficult launches with shorepound, is to get the Chinook EX pin style base and foot…or similar…single bolt or double…doesn’t matter… (some people call this a European base)
http://surfingsports.com/images/chinook_ex_pin1.jpg
http://surfingsports.com/images/chinook_ex_pin2.jpg
http://surfingsports.com/images/chinook … x_rdm1.jpg
http://surfingsports.com/images/chinook … x_rdm2.jpg
What matters, is having a convenient push button to release your board/rig…
You aren’t gonna be able to release it with the standard 2 button cup…have to get the board on it’s rail and the rig perfectly aligned to get your fingers in there to release…very difficult and takes too much time…
Another helpful item is to make a rope handle utilizing the double leash plugs…
http://www.surfingsports.com/standup_pads/big_blue2.jpg
http://www.surfingsports.com/standup_pa … blue04.jpg
http://www.surfingsports.com/standup_ba … _bags3.jpg
It’s way safer to hold onto your board in the shorepound with the tail handle, than holding onto the fin…
If you hold onto the fin, you will get sliced…these boards are big and the hydraulic forces involved are tremendous…
http://surfingsports.com/cali_longboard … ling71.jpg
Walking the board and rig backwards when getting out works mo bettah…
http://surfingsports.com/cali_longboard … ling67.jpg
don’t want to do this beginner move…way harder, even if you have big arms…
http://www.surfingsports.com/cali_stand … g_last.jpg
Another helpful item are the inserts that we have installed on the rails…
http://www.surfingsports.com/standup_pa … blue01.jpg
http://www.surfingsports.com/standup_pa … blue03.jpg
Fabricate some webbing handles…they are not in the way…and come in handy while transporting the board to and from the beach…my wifey and her friends really like them…makes it easier to carry the handle with other hand…
…and if you run a bungee across the mid-section and nose…you can secure your paddle in front of a big wave and turtle roll using both hands…otherwise, the Golden Rule of standup is NEVER LET GO OF YOUR PADDLE!!!…;-)
Lastly, you could install footstrap inserts on these boards…at one time, someone made very soft, flexible, foam straps…might have been the old NSI…or Padworkx…I even made some myself…
Lightweight race straps might work…
I installed them on a surfboard that I rode with straps…so that I could lay on them…
Even if you go strapless…you could still install webbing straps to help carry the board and lift it over rocks…
Gotta run…it’s blowin’ like stink…6th day in a row…
Mahalos…
Warm winds, good waves, & strong strokes…{:~)
WARDOG
Actually, I occasionally intentionally toss my paddle out past the break to surf a wave or two in the conventional lay down position. That only works well with a transitional board like the Jimmy Lewis 11′7″ or the Ku Nalu because they are narrow enough (26″) to hand paddle. If you do this it’s a good idea to wrap a turn or two of flourescent tape on your paddle handle so you can find it easily. I’ve never had a problem finding mine again–they stay put pretty well as long as they are past the breaking waves. You just stand up outside and look for them.
Adding handles and tie downs
From Jimmy Lewis via Linter: meanwhile, back at the ranch, i emailed jimmy about inserts and within hours he got back to me with advice that makes it clear that it’s a job for the professionals and not me; to wit, for any among us who still might want to give it a go:
(JL) “You CAN put inserts in but make sure you follow these instructions. True, you can melt the foam but ONLY if you put the epoxy in VOLUME. It’s not going to heat up unless you have a big gob of it in the hole. So what you want to do is route the hole that the insert goes in VERY close fitting to the insert. Don’t make a big hole where the insert is rattling around.
Then you epoxy it in. Now, the important thing about doing this is that you need to glass over the top of the inserts. If you don’t, there is a better than GOOD chance that it will leak. After you’ve epoxied the inserts in where you want them, sand the insert down level with the deck and sand the paint off in a radius of about an 1″ outside of the insert. Don’t sand too deep; just enough to take the paint and the primer off so you can see the glass. Then put two circles of 4oz glass over each insert with epoxy. This will seal where you’ve cut into the lamination to put the insert in. Make sure you get ALL of the pin air out of the little circles. Then you just drill
through the “caps” to open the hole and you could countersink it a tiny bit too. Then you’d only have to touch up the paint if you wanted it to look better.”
Pretty nice of JL, as well, to take time out of his day to write that kind of detailed response, and it’s that kind of customer service that makes people say great things about a business. well done, jimmy. keep it up!
Getting Up
Pick a day with minimal wind, little or no chop, and small waves. If you’re doing this on a lake–good for you. That’s perfect.
The easiest way to start is on your knees. Get in about two to three feet of water, push the board forward and slip onto it in a kneeling position right about in the middle. You’ll probably be slouched down almost in a crawling position at first–that’s okay. You’ll also fall off a lot even from this relatively stable position. Don’t sweat it, it doesn’t mean there’s no way you can do this. In a few hours you’ll wonder what the fuss was.
Immediately start paddling out towards the waves. Just choke up on the paddle and stroke on either side as necessary. If you can, try to feel the effect of stroking different ways. Initially you’ll be focusing on not falling off and won’t have any concentration left for learning other stuff. But as your stability increases, start trying things. If you paddle far away from the board it will turn more than if your paddle enters the water vertically and close to the board. If you sweep outwards a little at the end of the stroke it will tend to go straighter rather than turning away from the stroking side. As you pick up speed, kneel up straighter. You’ll find there are basically two kneeling positions–hunched and stable, or tall and not. Tall is better, it gives you more of a chance to gain your sea legs.
Once you’re moving along at some forward speed, lurch to your feet. The best way is any way you can do it, but most people who have surfed will find it easy to do a typical surfing “pop up” except that you’re starting from a kneeling position and their feet will come up in an athletic stance that’s suitable for more advanced paddling. At first you want your feet side-by-side, planted wide on the board–almost to the edges. It’s the most stable position. You want to be far enough forward so the board is flat in the water and nose is an inch or two off the water. If you’re too far back the board will stall and be hard to paddle. It will also be very unstable.
Feet centered–side by side position (photo courtesy Paddle Surf Hawaii)
Perhaps you’d like a more detailed description than “lurch to your feet”. Place your hands on the board a few inches ahead of your knees with the paddle in your dominant hand and the blade resting on the nose of the board. Press down with your arms straight and hop to a standing position with your knees bent deeply and your feet planted wide. Get the paddle in the water as quickly as you can–it will help stability–but stay in an athletic, knees bent stance. Look at the nose of the board and start paddling.
Your paddle is your friend–keep it in the water as much as possible. You can push the blade forward or back to keep from falling, and even lean on it or pull up on it momentarily to keep from falling.
If you’re having trouble keeping your balance, look at the tip of your board. It’s even helpful to have some feature there to look at. If your nose is featureless you might want to make a wax line across the tip so you can look at it. If you look at the water you’ll be right where you’re looking in short order. It’s not just target fixation, your body is moving relative to the board, not the water or the horizon.
If you’re in surf or chop, it’s easiest to go straight into the waves. As a larger wave or whitewater reaches the nose of the board, stick he paddle in just past the crest and pull yourself up into it. Before long you’ll be ploughing over good sized waves with no drama–it’s surprising how easy this part is. It’s much easier to get a standup board through whitewater or shorebreak than a regular surfboard because the wave doesn’t hit your body, just your feet.
Special Balance Problems
I suspect that almost anyone that can stand can do SUP at some level. Here’s a dialog with “Linter” about overcoming fundamental balance problems. Linter overcame his problems and is deeply involved in SUP:
Linter: Is anyone still giving any thought to canoe paddle surfing? On Swaylocks, an early Blane Chambers thread on it was deleted for reasons I don’t know (does anyone here?), and then in early ‘06 came back in a new form, under a thread entitled How to Safely Canoe Paddle w/ Pics, which was very informative. Since around then, however, I’ve rarely seen it mentioned. Has everyone forsworn it for stand-up paddle surfing? Is it considered too much like cheating?
The reason I ask is, I have certain neuro-muscular disorders involving balance that’ll make it well-nigh impossible for me to SUP. And making it even more close-to-impossible is that the board I just got is a 12′ softop, a handful even for good surfers. So, at 190 lbs and with certain physical issues, I think I’m going to be “stuck” doing the canoe paddle thing.
If anyone else is doing CP, maybe it’s evolved a little since Blane’s early posts on the subject, along the evolving lines of SUP. Care to share? Got any tips, especially as it might pertain to a softop? Thanks!
Billb: I assume you’re talking about sitting on the board with a standard canoe paddle or a kayak paddle. I’ve seen a few people doing it, including a friend of mine with artificial knees. There’s also a guy in Maui that had a rowing rack mounted onto a Laird SUP board–this is the kind of rack that reverses the oar pull so you can see where you’re going. I don’t know how that worked out.
There’s certainly plenty of people using surfskis and kayaks to surf.
I guess my first request is that you clarify your question.
My brother is very interested in SUP but he has balance problems resulting from a tumor on his auditory nerve. I don’t know the nature of your neuro-muscular problem, but I think SUP might be helpful to my brother, though it will certainly be challenging. With the right board I suspect he’ll be able to do it. But you’re right–at 190 pounds a 12 foot softop would be very difficult for anyone, and impossible for me (at 250).
I’d encourage you to try a suitable board before you give up on SUP. Balance can be improved, if it couldn’t, there’s no way I could do SUP. It may be that you never be Laird Hamilton, but you could be sucessful at a level that would give you a lot of satisfaction, as I am.
Linter: Thanks for weighing in, bill. actually, i do ride a waveski and it’s great fun; but i’d also like to stand-up surf if at all possible. as per Blane’s Swaylocks thread, the idea with canoe paddle surfing is, you’re *kneeling* on the board and using a paddle that’s maybe 48″ long to propel yourself. once you catch the wave, you pop up to standing from that kneeling position.
Yup, it sounds like your bro and I are in the same, er, boat.
And I know you’re right: with practice, I could improve my balance; but then the issue becomes, how do you test and buy the “right” board if you don’t even really have the regular balance skills to see what feels best? Got any suggestions? I live in new england and think several places around here have SUPs for sale, probably Surftech Lairds, though I know how fond you are of your Jimmy Lewis 11′, and I’d sure like to be able to test ride one of those, though maybe it’d be far too much for me given what’s going on with my balance business.
Billb: I’d go for the Laird. It’s the most stable board around with only the JL 11 as a very close second. I would expect that most shops will have demos eventually, or a board available to rent. The interest in SUP is through the roof. The Surftech Laird can be surfed at a very high level, as Teddy, Laird’s right hand guy, has conclusively demonstrated to me. Even if it turns out that you can’t do standup, it would be a good board for canoe paddling.
I’d be surprised though if you could canoe paddle but not standup. Lurching to your feet from your knees is more difficult than standing to begin with. You don’t have a stable platform to pop from as you do in the laying down position of regular surfing and you have a paddle in the way.
As I’m sure you know, balance can come from a variety of senses. When you’re young and flexible it comes mostly from the inner ear. But geezers like me rely a lot on vision to balance. That’s why older people have a very hard time balancing on one foot with their eyes closed. We also have to learn the weight shifts and movements that keep us on the board. It’s amazing how you can progress from falling off in dead calm water to standing comfortably in heavy chop and waves. It’s more than balance, it’s practiced movements.
Linter: Well er ah um — i’m now the proud owner of a jimmy 11! Wow boy did that happen fast! Anyway, it’s a beaut — red on top, white on the bottom and surprisingly light. I left it at the shop to have some leash plug inserts installed on the sides for carry handles. Believe me, given my balance issues and the rocky hilly terrain around here, i need handles.
Linter: Well, got my jimmy-11 out for the first time today and messed around on it for about 20 minutes, which is when the thunder and lightning started. Knee paddling was no problem but there was a mighty wobbling of the legs when i got to my feet. But at least I was on my feet! And making headway! So what I know now, I think, is that I *can* do this even given my leg and balance issues. It’ll take time before I’m wave ready but that’s okay. I’m stoked! And I s’pose if I want to ride some wave while I’m getting my stand-up sea legs in order, I could always paddle in to some on my knees, canoe style.
Pretty cool. Linter’s success has my brother stoked so much that he’s been losing weight and getting in shape to give SUP a shot. I think he’ll do fine and it will be great excercise for him.
Getting Better: Once you are able to stand and paddle on the board, you need board time to improve. Spending as much time on the board as you can will quickly build the muscles you need to do this sport, and give you the subtle balance training you need to improve. Here’s some things to start paying attention to:
Paddling–reach forward with your paddle and put the blade in almost vertically, close to the board. Stroke back, visualising pulling the board forward in the water. Don’t try to extend the stroke too far past your legs, that angles the blade too much and pulls the board edge downwards. Your blade is angled forwards for two reasons–to make the blade more stable in the water (as you’ll see if you try to stroke with the blade backwards) and to improve the release of the blade as you pull it up. Stroking too far backwards defeats that smooth release.
Foot position–You generally want to retain the centered stance for long distance paddling on flat water because its more stable and gives you easier, even paddle transitions from side to side. But when the surface is choppy or you’re in waves you’ll want to adopt a more fore and aft stance with your dominant foot forward just as in normal surfing. If you’re not a surfer and you don’t know which foot is your dominant one, slide on a slick floor with your socks on, or hop up onto a high step. The foot you put forward is your dominant foot. Left foot forward is “Regular Foot” right is “Goofy Foot”. Attach your leash to the rearward foot. You might prefer a calf leash instead of an ankle leash for a board as large as most SUP boards.
Foot forward position–more power, less side-to-side balance. The stroke bias that would normally push the board to the right of the picture is countered by the weight on the left rail (surfer’s right). (photo courtesy Paddle Surf Hawaii)
Happy feet–You need to learn that your feet are not bolted to the board. As your balance improves you can move around the board more. In flatwater you need to initate this learning by forcing yourself to move your feet around. Shift from centered to fore and aft stance. Move your back foot more towards the tail then back centered again. In chop your learning will be automatic–when you master sideways chop you’re bound to be moving about on the board.
Spinning the board. Step back or lean back on the rear foot, paddle hard (photo courtesy Paddle Surf Hawaii)
Turning and Spinning–Initially you’ll be turning the board slowly by stroking away from the board, but this is the slow way around. Fine for flatwater, but too slow to surf. The faster way is to put weight on the back of the board and stroke with the paddle to pivot the board. Once you are in a fore and aft position you can start practicing this by just putting weight on your back leg.
Works even better if you take a step backwards. You need to lean on the paddle a bit to optimize these moves. Once you can spin the board 360 you’re ready to surf.
Paddle Handling (copied from a separate post)
This is a little reptetitive since I copied it into this document from a separate post, but the information is good and I’ve added to the original post.
I’ve been learning a lot more about standup paddle surfing lately, because I’ve been teaching it to some other people. There’s no faster way to learn than to teach someone else. Most of what I’ve been learning has to do with using your paddle, hence the title.
First of all, resist the urge to choke up on the handle and hold it any way but with one hand on the top T, and the other part way down the shaft. I see people holding the paddle like a broom and taking little ineffective swipes at the water. All this does is upset your balance. You need to be in an athletic stance, knees flexed, back straight and arms extended. You use your legs, back and shoulders to paddle when you’re doing it well.
Put the paddle in the water about as far forward as you can reach it with the handle nearly vertical. You reach out with your lower arm most, the upper arm a little less, and you bend your knees some to push your upper body forward. Place the paddle and pull it back close to the side of the board in a straight line. Think of it as pulling the board forward through the water, NOT flinging water backwards to propel you forwards.
Pull the paddle out just as it reaches your feet, when the blade is still vertical. Even with a forward-raked blade, if you stroke the paddle behind you the blade is at an angle to the surface very much like you are lifting a shovelfull of water. This pulls you down as you lift it out of the water, upsetting your balance. Beginners fall into the water at the end of their paddling stroke. This is why.
Yesterday (April 13) I was teaching my nephew how to do stand up and noticed a guy who was flailing away on a Munoz soft top. When he managed to get into a wave he did elegant bottom turns, top turns and cutbacks and cross-stepped his way to the nose–clearly an accomplished and experienced longboard surfer. But when he was paddling for a wave he’d sweep the paddle far back and he was falling into the face of the wave at the end of the stroke. Bingo. I showed him how to reach out to the nose and stop the stroke at his feet. Instantly he was able to catch any wave without falling. A simple change but very important.
To turn, put the paddle in the water way up near the nose, and sweep outwards. Again, beginners tend to put the paddle out perpendicular to the board and sweep backwards. Not only do they not get good leverage, but they upset their balance. Instead, start at the nose and sweep until the blade is nearly perpendicular to the board, then sweep again from the nose as many times as you need to. By doing this you are getting the greatest amount of leverage against the fin, which is pretty much the pivot point for the turn unless you have a very small fin.
Not only does this improve your balance, but also you can turn faster and you’ll be able to get more knee and hip movement into your turn.
Practice changing paddle sides without interrupting your stroke rythym. Canoe paddlers do it all the time, and they’re sitting, so it’s harder. You need to be able to do it fluidly to catch waves. Sometimes accelerating to catch a wave will turn the board, and you need to correct without losing speed or power.
Reverse sweeping the paddle to regain your balance is a valuable move. Anytime during a paddle stroke that you start losing your balance you can reverse your stroke direction with a quick outward sweep. The reverse bend of the paddle creates a powerful thrust that you can lean against to regain your balance. With practice this move becomes automatic, and it will save you from a dunking. This movement and dragging the paddle blade on the face of a wave or in the whitewater are really the only moves you should make with the paddle behind you. It’s no surprise that both of these moves are balancing moves–you tend to fall backwards on long boards to begin with. Don’t exacerbate the problem by making strokes past your feet.
Another handy move is placing your paddle blade in the center of the board and using it as a third leg. Don’t rely on this too often, the best place for the paddle is in the water, but if you need to reposition your feet, or you need a little rest, it’s a handy tool. If you’re going to rest long it’s a good idea to reverse the paddle and rest the T on the deck–a little more stable and easier on the board and paddle blade.
Getting into the Wave
Generally you’re standing pointed out at the waves, looking for one you like and the location of the peak. Once you find one, paddle towards the peak, and when the wave is still a pretty good distance away (unless you’ve become REALLY good at turning around) start your turn. Don’t panic and rush it, get the blade in up by the nose and push yourself around with steady, powerful sweeps. When you are pointed more or less at the beach, switch sides and start paddling. The reason for the switch is that you will almost always overdo the turn, even when you think you haven’t turned enough. You don’t want to switch just as the wave starts to lift the tail.
As the tail starts to lift, move your normal surfing rear foot a good step back, and give a good paddle thrust. As you start down the wave you’ll probably need to lean back on that back leg, or even hop back more to keep the nose up. You can dig the blade in behind you on the inside of the wave (away from the shoulder) to help keep the nose up and start your turn. Unlike conventional surfing, you want to get your bottom turn done as soon as possble. Unless you are a good surfer you’ll find it hard to swing the nose around quickly.
If you don’t catch the wave immediately, don’t just give up. You can paddle a lot faster with a standup paddle boards, and a few strong strokes can get you into a wave that either hasn’t stood up enough to give you good drive, or that’s a little past the center of gravity of your board. It’s worth a try. I’d say that thirty percent of the waves I catch and ride are ones that I wouldn’t get if I didn’t chase them down with hard paddling.
If the wave crumbles on you and you’re in the whitewater, you can often ride past it by letting the nose of the board slide back more straight in to the beach, and rest the blade on the whitewater to brace yourself. Once you’ve gotten past the crumbled section you can swing back and get up on the wave.
These are big boards, they move deliberately, like a big ship. The guys that are good toss them around pretty neatly, but at first you want to make your movements subtle and smooth.
Surfing Stand Up
When you get into surf the liklihood of scaring the heck out of yourself increases geometrically. The fear has a basis–you can get hurt or killed. You WILL get hurt sooner or later, it’s part of the deal. Here’s some things to consider:
Understand the area you’re surfing. I’ve ridden a board way past where everyone else was bailing out of the wave only to find myself in ten inches of water over coral covered lava. Not fun. You need to watch what other people are doing. Know how and where to get into and out of the water. Spend some time watching what the waves do and where the shallow spots are.
You’re going to fall. when you do, take a deep breath before you hit, try to fall into the wave–with the board between you and the shore. If you’re in shallow water and small waves try to land flat (picture not sinking at all). In bigger waves and deeper water tuck your chin down and curl up, cover your head with your arms. Try to punch into the face of the wave so it doesn’t break on top of you. Relax, don’t struggle, save your energy and your air. Wait for the thrashing to end, then open your eyes, find the top, and swim calmly for the surface. When your head breaks the surface get a good breath and look outside to see where the next wave is. If you have time you can pull your board to you and hug it, but don’t do that if the wave is right on top of you. Paddle out of the impact zone. Thank the gods of the sea that they’ve spared your sorry ass once again.
If you’re not scared when you’re surfing you’re either Laird Hamilton, Dave Kalama, or stupid. And the last time I saw Laird he had fourteen stitches in his face from a little face/board interception incident at Ho’okipa and a cheek that looked like Popeye.
Laird with popeye face modification. He’s as good as they get and he can still get hurt. Of course he got smacked in the face with a 14 foot board and never quit smiling, so there’s that. Photo courtesy Maui Surf/Windsurf Forecast, Giampaolo Cammarota
to be continued…
http://web.mac.com/tomtomproductions1/iweb/tomtomproductions1 lots of stand up pics
http://www.ronhousepaddlesurf.com for boards
Its an exciting time in the surfing world for SUP surfing…. Myself along with Dave Parmenter are focused on the advanced side of things and build boards for High Performance SUP surfing. The biggest and most important thing to remember is how to surf with Aloha. There definetly needs to be more emphasis on board builders to educate customers on how to co-exsist with other surfers… All the beginners need to surf away from others!!! All the good guys need to refrain from being wave HOGS! Be a GIVER not a TAKER.
Aloha,
Blane Chambers
http://www.paddlesurfhawaii.com
thanks Blane, I’ve added an introduction section that I’m working on to help people understand how to behave and get involved in as safe and gracious a manner as possible.
Thanks Tom, great looking boards. I’ll get in touch with you about getting copies of some of your shots. Love that standup catamaran. that looks like fun.
hey!
im from germany!i want to start stand up p.surfing!
its very hard to get a board in germany!
now i orderd a laird hamilton 12,1 from tuff light!
we have almost small waves so i think its a good to take a big one!
im 6.8 inch big so i need a 7.6 inch paddle(is that right?)
i hope the board is good!
greetings from germany
bastian langer
Hi Bastian,
The Laird is very good, easy to get started with. It’s very stable, turns well, and it’s great for long distance paddling because it cruises. So far I haven’t liked it as well as the Jimmy Lewis or the Ku Nalu in the surf, but I haven’t used it very much, so I might just need to get used to it.
Today I’m going to do a “review” of the three boards I own, I’ll shoot some pictures, maybe a little video, and swap the fins around to see what I get.
Are you sure you did the conversion right from centimeters? 6′8″ is extremely tall–like professional basketball player, one in a million tall. If you are that tall you probably have long arms, you might want to start out even longer than the usual 10 to 11 inches over your head. You can always cut more off, but it’s hard to add. Don’t glue the paddle together at first. Use some of that waterproof aluminum tape.
Have fun with your new board.
fantastic write up! plus, i just got back from visiting tom english’s site and his tomtom flicks of SUP are terrific, too.
right now i’m trying to learn on a 12′ softop and am finding it pretty frustrating, maybe because it’s not nearly as wide as the stand-up specific boards. any suggestions?
one thing i’m thinking is that some smarty pants somewhere should be able to devise a mini-outrigger or pontoon system for the softop, something to add a few inches of width without entirely messing up the board’s ability to turn on the wave. hmmmm.
keep up the great work!
When I first started, I tried a big softop and almost decided that SUP was something I just wasn’t going to be able to do. You WILL be able to learn on that thing, especially if you are light enough, but it won’t be the easiest path. Unless you are willing to buy another board you’ll just have to persist until your brain and muscle reactions work out how to stay on top of the board.
I considered an outrigger too–training wheels–but training wheels on a bicycle don’t really train, they just let you simulate doing something that you haven’t learned to do. You don’t really learn how to ride one until you take them off.
Even the wider boards don’t get you completely ready to handle shorter boards, it’s time on the water that does that. I was surprised to find I could stand on my JL 11′7″ during this comparison, but it wasn’t pretty. But guys that are doing SUP at a high level are using boards that make your softtop look huge.
The bast advice I can give is persist. It will come.
thanks for your optimism! right now, i’m at my winter blubbery weight of around 185 or 190, so maybe that’s part of the problem: i’ve got to slim down some!
meanwhile, i’m thinking that using the biggest fin i can find might help w/ stabililty at least a little, though at the expense of turning on the wave.
anyway, love your site and i hope it continues to grow. it’s very helpful.
cool blog!
nice photos of this blog
Just got a 9′6″ SUP from Blane… Its amazing. Like riding a fish except you can paddle it. Works pretty well even in the choppy, windy conditions we’ve had lately on Maui. Nice to have a board I can actually turn. It’s surprisingly stable. Had absolutly no problem transistioning from a 12′er.
Screech,
Wow, that’s pretty short. What the heck do you weigh. I’d assume that’s a wide thick board, though at the Tropic Energy Games I saw some SUP boards that were amazingly small, though some of the competitors were on Ku Nalus.
Troy,
A big fin definitely helps stability. The JL 11er comes with a 14″ fin that certainly makes it easy to get on initially. But a few days on the thing and you start thinking “there has to be a way to turn this thing”.
I’m working on some ways to consolidate all the conversations on SUP and Longboard wavesailing in a single blog (right now they’re scattered over both the blogs I maintain).
I can’t believe how many SUP boards are coming out. We’ll be spoiled for choice soon. I think all the manufacturers are looking at the prevailing price for SUP boards and jumping in. For about the same amount of effort (short boards take a lot of time even if they don’t use as much materials) you can get three times the money. Easy choice.
Hi billb… I’m 125lbs…. The board is actually not thaaat big, 27″wide, 4.25″thick. Amazingly stable for its size. Tri-Fin… Its the standard Paddle Surf Hawaii 9″6″ template. Another friend rode it the other day and he’s 170lb I think. He also loved it and had no problem transistioning from the 12′ Surftech Munoz Super Glide to this board.
I really wanted something that I could ride in bigger surf and this was one of the smaller boards I could find. Considered the Ordonez but still thought it would be to big. I am really happy with my choice. Figured after seeing the images of Blane and the guys on the bigger waves, they would be able make a board that truely surfed well.
Hey,
I’m being reading and asking around and I think I’ve settled on two choices for a board. I’m considering the Sean Ordonez Big Blue or Jimmy Lewis JL 11’7”. I’m 6′ feet, 130 pounds and have no surfing expeirence except for kiteboading. also i live in miami, so there is barely any surf, usually 2-3 feet, and 4-5+ on rare ocassions. I’m leaning toward the JL because of it’s longboard ability, but i’m worried it might be a little unstaple for a begginer like me. Let me know what you suggest.
thanks, Jose
Hey Bill, nice blog. Just what I needed.
I’m a long long time surfer just about to embark on SUP so this is just cool. Of course, I’ll forget 3/4s of it, but that’s okay I read it.
Gonna go borrow a board from Steve at Infinity in DP, he’s doing good stuff with this, and go puddle around and see how it feels. It looks like way too much fun to miss so I’m looking forward to it. I’ll get back to you on that.
Anyway, thanks.
Ron in San Clemente
Hey Bill,
Okay so I borrowed a board that is 11′ and 28″ and 4.75 thick and I’m thinkin: this board is fricken HUGE. Wrong. It actually was quite a bit too small (I’m 6′3 and 225) and it gave me no end of grief. Tippy and really hard to control, and today I am one sore puppy from holding that lateral balance. What a great workout though.
Oh yeah and I love it.
But a suggestion. Make sure the first board you use is, if anything, way big for you. Not too small. First time out you won’t be doing any Laird moves anyway. Gotta figure out how to handle the damn thing first. Even for a long time surfer there is that paddle in there confusing things. Just getting used to that takes some work without having to contend with a hard to balance board.
Oh yeah and make sure the paddle is long enough too. A short paddle makes you lean sideways, not good.
Anyway way maybe I’m just a total klutz but that’s my thought.
Ron
I have a sudden penchant for long boards but feel I am showing my age and it hurts. I love my custom MR 6′4″ and would not give it up for the world but…. I also have a history of competative K1 white water slalom and I am seeing a certain synergy between a relatively flat day here on the north coast of NSW Australia, my existing skills and SUP. I want one of these things. There are people advertising in Tracks (surfing mag) for Jimmy Lewis SUP boards sizes 10′, 11′ and 11′7″. I am 70 kg and 5′11.
Recomendations for purchase?
Okay I went to a 11′7 30″ wide: night and day. I didn’t have to spend all that energy just to stand on it. Didn’t get worked to death and I could actually pay attention to how it works.
Now I just have to get one past my wife. . .think she’ll notice?
when you work out a strategy, let me know, cause I gotta do the same trick. How do you make a massive epoxy paddle board invisible while attempting to camoflage a similarly proportioned hole in your bank account?
I reckon we’re stuffed, mate!
Ron: you took care of your problem before I could say anything.
I suspect you could get away with a slightly narrower board, but anything a little too big will be more fun than something that’s a little too small.
Karl–perhaps you guys can convince your significant other’s that it’s part of an exercise plan to keep you young and slim–way cheaper than gym membership. Or maybe a dining room table?
Hey Karl
My husband and I bought 2 SUP boards late last year (made at Burleigh Heads) and we are just about to buy 2 more. Why? Coz we have learnt over the last 6 months that our boards (coolite…like a true paddleboard, 12ft long, 4-41/2 thick, 28″ wide) are perfect for smooth glide and flat water paddling or riding bumps and doing downwinds (which is fine coz in Hervey Bay where we live there is no surf). But, the problem is that when we take these boards surfing, they are way too corky and the rails are just too thick. So…you need to work out if your board is for paddling and surfing OR for surfing and paddling.
Over last weekend, we have some friends at Noosa who kindly let us try their SUP boards and it is amazing how much better theirs surf…BUT…when I took one on a sightseeing paddle around to National Park, our boards gliiiiiide so much better and you can feel so much less resistance on each stroke, coz it feels like they are slipping over the water, rather than ploughing slightly through it. So we are doing a lot of research and asking heaps of questions of a few very good SUP boarders up on the Sunshine Coast, so that we get the specs right for surfing, not so much paddling.
All the best in your hunt and welcome to the SUP fraternity on the east coast of Oz
Janita K
I’ve now put in a pretty fair amount of time into this so here’s my update. I’m now about 40 hours into this sport and a lot of my initial problems are gone. I think it’s just time on the water that will solve most issues. This blog and the allaluminumtour.com blog are super resources for beginners. Thanks Bill.
Check out this video made from today using a Digital Hero 3 and shot at Pop’s in Waikiki Oahu.
http://www.greatergoodradio.com/video/SUP-Waikiki0507.wmv
The guy in the white top is me and the skinny guy in the blue top is my brother. The big guy with the blue top and hat is our friend Harris. Both my brother and Harris are riding Surftech Laird’s and my brother is on the Laird I bought from Bill. I’m on a friend’s custom shaped Ron House Laird 11′4″ x 28″ x 4. You’ll notice how stable the Surftech’s are. I weigh 210 lbs and my friend is probably 230 lbs. My brother is 170 lbs.
I finally got a chance to ride a Jimmy Lewis 11′er and also visited Jimmy at his shop. You can see some pics and short video from his shop in the middle of this video.
http://www.greatergoodradio.com/video/KiteMaui2007_0001.wmv
I reserved Bill’s old Jimmy 11′er at Hawaiian Island, paid in advance and called at least 5 times during the previous week to make sure they held it for me. I was only in Maui for less than 24 hours so I wanted to try it for the day. About 10 min before the scheduled pickup time they called me and said they made a mistake and rented it to another guy. I was not happy to say the least. To their credit, Lenny the owner hunted down the guy that rented the board and I was able to try it for 2 hours just before I left Maui. I guess 2 hours is better than nothing and I can honestly say that the Jimmy is the most stable, easy to stand up on and paddle board I’ve tried so far. I tried it at Kite Beach in Maui in 20 mph winds and chop and was still able to paddle around. Needless to say, I’m getting one when they come in and I may have Jimmy shape me a custom 10′ board after I ride the 11′er for a while.
I lent the Suftech Laird to a friend who has been learning on the custom Ron House board. The Ron House is much more tippy although it surfs pretty awesome. Once my friend got on the Surftech Laird he was so happy and instantly got better. It was like night and day. The board does make a big difference when learning.
Wow, great comments Evan. If you’d like to write some articles on this blog I’ll be glad to give you author rights. All you need to do is register, and I can add you to the authorized writer’s list, then you’ll be able to create your own entries.
Hey, Jaunita, thanks for the comments. I’m working with some friends on Maui to build a board that’s right for both surfing and cruising. I don’t think the two need to be mutually exclusive, in fact I think they both demand the same things of the board. What might be impossible is to combine good surfing and cruising into a BEGINNER board.
For example, the Ku Nalu board is the best cruiser I’ve tried–it seems like a single stroke carries you yards and yards, while the JL 11er feels like you travel the length of the stroke and not an inch further. It’s also not the best surfing board. But it’s amazingly stable, maneuverable and a decent surfer. The Ku Nalu is an excellent surfer, it’s nearly as good as the magical JL 11′7″.
So what we’re trying to do is borrow a little stability from the general outline of the JL 11er (but a bit narrower) with the cruising ability of the Ku Nalu in the bottom and rails. The result should be an intermediate board. If it works out well go into limited production.
Bill:
I am about to buy a SUP. I am 6′6″/240. I have a windsufing background.
I am looking at Big Red and the SB 12′6″
I know you have not got your SB yet, but what motivated you to buy one? This is Svein’s design…do you think it will be a good surfer? Apparently, this is different from Jeff’s 12.5 proto.
I know you have a lot of different boards now, I am trying to get it right on one shot.
Thanks for your help.
With your size and weight I suspect the Starboard would be good. My motivation was the mast track, the general appearance of the board, but most importantly Giampaolo Cammarota’s recommendation. If you go to the Maui Hot Sails forum and look at the longboard section http://www.hotsailsmaui.com/forum/viewforum.php?id=4 you can find a test that Giampaolo did of the two Starboard boards.
I have to confess that I don’t care for the Big Red very much. If you can get your hands on a JL 11er I suspect you’d find it’s the right board for your size, weight, and current skill level. It’s not the best surfing board ever, but I think it’s the best all around board so far, and you’ll be immediately successful using it. I haven’t outgrown mine in any way, in fact I can’t wait to get back to Maui and use my new one (Jimmy’s is replacing the one I had).
When I first saw the outline of the JL 11′, I was kind of put off. Based on what I read from you, as well as the video from Real Kiteboarding, and what I hear from Wardog… I agree it looks like a nice board for the surf. I really like the price too, but in the end, I decided I want a mast track.
Can you share what you did not like about Big Red when you tried it? Have you sailed it?
Thanks in advance.
I haven’t sailed it, just paddled it. I didn’t like the initial instability–it’s hard to stand on, and it doesn’t glide at all, it’s worse at that than the JL 11er.
I understand the desire for a mast track–sailing these boards is a great thing for an old windsurfer. You might want to consider the Starboard 12″6″ or 12″2″. Both have mast tracks. They should be available about now. I’d suggest you try them out if that’s at all possible for you. It’s a pain to find that you just don’t like a board once you’ve bought it.
Is anyone still giving any thought to canoe paddle surfing? On Swaylocks, an early Blane Chambers thread on it was deleted for reasons I don’t know (does anyone here?), and then in early ‘06 came back in a new form, under a thread entitled How to Safely Canoe Paddle w/ Pics, which was very informative. Since around then, however, I’ve rarely seen it mentioned. Has everyone forsworn it for stand-up paddle surfing? Is it considered too much like cheating?
The reason I ask is, I have certain neuro-muscular disorders involving balance that’ll make it well-nigh impossible for me to SUP. And making it even more close-to-impossible is that the board I just got is a 12′ softop, a handful even for good surfers. So, at 190 lbs and with certain physical issues, I think I’m going to be “stuck” doing the canoe paddle thing.
If anyone else is doing CP, maybe it’s evolved a little since Blane’s early posts on the subject, along the evolving lines of SUP. Care to share? Got any tips, especially as it might pertain to a softop? Thanks!
I assume you’re talking about sitting on the board with a standard canoe paddle or a kayak paddle. I’ve seen a few people doing it, including a friend of mine with artificial knees. There’s also a guy in Maui that had a rowing rack mounted onto a Laird SUP board–this is the kind of rack that reverses the oar pull so you can see where you’re going. I don’t know how that worked out.
There’s certainly plenty of people using surfskis and kayaks to surf.
I guess my first request is that you clarify your question.
My brother is very interested in SUP but he has balance problems resulting from a tumor on his auditory nerve. I don’t know the nature of your neuro-muscular problem, but I think SUP might be helpful to my brother, though it will certainly be challenging. With the right board I suspect he’ll be able to do it. But you’re right–at 190 pounds a 12 foot softop would be very difficult for anyone, and impossible for me (at 250).
I’d encourage you to try a suitable board before you give up on SUP. Balance can be improved, if it couldn’t, there’s no way I could do SUP. It may be that you never be Laird Hamilton, but you could be sucessful at a level that would give you a lot of satisfaction, as I am.
thanks for weighing in, bill. actually, i do ride a waveski and it’s great fun; but i’d also like to stand-up surf if at all possible. as per Blane’s Swaylocks thread, the idea with canoe paddle surfing is, you’re *kneeling* on the board and using a paddle that’s maybe 48″ long to propel yourself. once you catch the wave, you pop up to standing from that kneeling position. here’s a link to blane’s post, with pix showing exactly what i mean:
http://www.swaylocks.com/forum/gforum.cgi?post=254804#254804.
Yup, it sounds like your bro and I are in the same, er, boat.
And I know you’re right: with practice, I could improve my balance; but then the issue becomes, how do you test and buy the “right” board if you don’t even really have the regular balance skills to see what feels best? Got any suggestions? I live in new england and think several places around here have SUPs for sale, probably Surftech Lairds, though I know how fond you are of your Jimmy Lewis 11′, and I’d sure like to be able to test ride one of those, though maybe it’d be far too much for me given what’s going on with my balance business.
I’d go for the Laird. It’s the most stable board around with only the JL 11 as a very close second. I was going to send mine to my brother, but the shipping was prohibitive.
I would expect that most shops will have demos eventually, or a board available to rent. The interest in SUP is through the roof. The Surftech Laird can be surfed at a very high level, as Teddy, Laird’s right hand guy, has conclusively demonstrated to me. Even if it turns out that you can’t do standup, it would be a good board for canoe paddling.
I’d be surprised though if you could canoe paddle but not standup. Lurching to your feet from your knees is more difficult than standing to begin with. You don’t have a stable platform to pop from as you do in the laying down position of regular surfing and you have a paddle in the way.
As I’m sure you know, balance can come from a variety of senses. When you’re young and flexible it comes mostly from the inner ear. But geezers like me rely a lot on vision to balance. That’s why older people have a very hard time balancing on one foot with their eyes closed. We also have to learn the weight shifts and movements that keep us on the board. It’s amazing how you can progress from falling off in dead calm water to standing comfortably in heavy chop and waves. It’s more than balance, it’s practiced movements.
The thing I was thinking with regard to canoe paddling is that i’d be in a more stable position paddling around on my knees (relative to SUP) at least until it came time to get to my feet; then, of course, i’d wish i was standing already.
I don’t know about demo Laird’s but I’m pretty sure there’s a 12′ Infinity SUP demo around nearby. Know anything about them?
Actually, you hit the nail on the head when you mention “weight shifts and movements that keep us on the board.” I think, to a large degree, they are micro movements and that’s my neuro problem: the message to shift my weight and make small corrective movements often gets tangled up and lost in transmission. Once I’m on my feet and on a wave, I’m okay; until then, it’s dicey at best. But practice on a Laird or similar would help a lot, I’m sure.
Most SUP surfers catch their first waves on their knees, so you’ll be in good company.
I haven’t heard of the Infinity, I’d take a look at the width and thickness. You want something at least 30 inches wide to learn on, and a big tail is a plus.
Aloha folks… another factor to throw in… weight of the boards. I ride the Paddle Surf Hawaii 9′6″ and it weighs only 18lbs. I tried a Jimmy Lewis custom 9′6″ this weekend and could hardly pick the thing up it was so heavy. It took a lot more power to get it going as well although once it did, it glided well. I ride mainly in surf, big and small. Of course I’m 125lbs so it doesnt take much to float me. I’ve had bigger guys ride it and it seems to float them fine as well. Their main comments were that it was almost too responsive, but not that tippy. My first board was the Surftech 12′ Munoz which is pretty light as well. Does seem like most the guys like the heavy boards.
I do have to just get in the right spot on the wave and take 1 maybe 2 strokes to get in rather than line up and paddle a bunch on the bigger, heavier boards. Takes a little getting used too.
Yup, custom boards tend to be a lot heavier than production boards. For the glide, weight is your friend, but not for acceleration. My JL 11er is a production board and it’s very light, turns on a dime and gives you nine cents change, but it does not glide.
The Ku Nalu is a hollow custom, considered light but it’s more than 26 pounds. Glides well. Part of it is the width, but part is surely the weight.
Linter - If you don’t need to stand up and already are good on the surfski you may want to try the Wave Witch Pocket Rocket. http://www.huntjohnsendesigns.com/index.htm#wavewitch It surf unreal and you can easily get back out through the chop bc of the nose and rocker. I can catch virtually anything on it but the only thing I can’t do on it is stand. That’s why I like the SUP Board. If you’re in small waves and mainly cruising, stability is going to be your friend. I’ve owned the Big Red and Surftech Laird and anyone can ride the Laird. It doesn’t surf that well but it’s not that bad considering the size. I just went out today in perfect glassy conditions at Canoe’s in Waikiki and caught anything I wanted. You can also sit or kneel if you get tired so it’s really comfortable. My first choice is the Jimmy 11′er, just like Bill. It’s super stable and the sweet spot for standing seems to be bigger. What I mean is that I can stand forward or back comfortably much more comfortably than on any other board.
WSURFN - If you need the masttrack bc you’re gonna windsurf the board then the Jimmy is out. I’m not sure on the Starboard bc I haven’t tried it yet but at 27″ wide it’s probably going to be tippy for your weight, especially with the pulled nose and tail. If you have really great balance then it won’t matter as much but in the beginning it’s much more fun to have a stable board. I sold my Big Red because although it surfed pretty good, it was tippy for a 12′ board. I like the Surftech Laird bc it’s stable but it takes some energy to move since it’s so big. The Jimmy was just as stable as the Laird and 1 foot shorter. I haven’t gotten it yet bc it’s still clearing customs but everyone I’ve spoken to says it surfs just as well if not better than the Big Red in small surf. Once the surf gets bigger then some rocker helps but if the waves are crumbly anyway like on Oahu’s south shore then it doesn’t make a big difference.
I went out yesterday in chest high Oahu North Shore at Cammie’s which is left of Sunset. The wind was strong and the current was wicked. I had to sit down and paddle continuously to stay in place. I had a hell of a time balancing on the custom Ron House Laird 11′4″ x 28″ x 4″. It surfs great but is tippy for my size (215 lbs and 6′). I got on my Surftech Laird and it was night and day. I could catch waves and balance…although I got worked that day it was much easier. I guess it depends on what you’re planning to do on the board.
Wardog told me about a new custom 10′4″ x 29″ x4″ quad he’s now selling. He said for bigger guys it’s stable and surfs unreal. I also saw Todd Bradley this afternoon at the Outrigger Canoe Club and he said his C4 Waterman Boardworks boards are gonna be great. I’m supposed to demo the 10′6″ x 28.5″ x 4″ soon and I’ll post how it was.
Here’s the Wardog quad:
http://www.standuppaddlesurf.com/blair_sup/index.html
C4 Boards:
http://www.boardworkssurf.com/html/boardgallery/c4waterman.html
Jimmy 11′ and new 10′:
http://www.surfingsports.com/blog.asp
well, it seems there aren’t any jimmys around here for me to try, but i’ve learned i can get one shipped to me sight unseen for around the same (retail) price with shipping as if i bought locally and paid tax. lairds are around but none to demo. the infinity you can demo but if i’m going to go SUP i’d rather get something that’s more tried and true. so then it boils down to laird at 12′ or jimmy at 11′. what you would do, given all the variables and whatnot involved?? thanks again.
I’d get the Jimmy Lewis 11er. It’s simply a great design.
Jimmy 11 for sure
Linter - I would definitely go w/ the Jimmy and not the Infinity for what you are trying to do. The Infinity boards that I’ve seen have been too narrow for big guys over 200 lbs. I think they surf well but standing on it may be tippy. It’s definitely more tippy than the Jimmy 11′er and what you need is stability.
I tried a friend’s brian caldwell custom 10′er today. Surprisingly it held my weight and I could paddle it…barely. I could get it going but when it was time to catch the wave I couldn’t handle so I kept eating it. I think it may be ok with some practice and it was interesting to feel such a small board since I’m used to 11′4″ or 12′1″. I think with some time on it the surfing ability with a ’small’ board may be pretty good…maybe later in my learning curve.
My friend rode my Surftech Laird today in awesome glassy Waikiki chest high waves. He did pretty good for his second day and we stayed out for 3 hours. He’s an experienced surfer and by the end of the day was doing pretty good and catching waves. I think he’ll be really good after a few more sessions.
I’m actually noticing that I’m developing more muscle. It’s still hidden beneath all my fat but at least it’s starting to show life. It will be interesting to see if this SUP thing will help me lose weight. Everyone else I’ve spoken to seems to lose weight so I hope I’m included.
Here is a video view from an 8′ pole attached to my paddle.
Aloha,
Tom English
http://web.mac.com/tomtomproductions1/iweb/tomtomproductions1/Pole%20Cam%20Video.html
Tom - Are you riding a custom Ron House Laird? How do you like your board and how much do you weigh?
well er ah um — i’m now the proud owner of a jimmy 11! wow boy did that happen fast!
anyway, it’s a beaut — red on top, white on the bottom and surprisingly light. i left it at the shop to have some leash plug inserts installed on the sides for carry handles. believe me, given my balance issues and the rocky hilly terrain around here, i need handles.
the way my arms reach around the thing, the most comfortable position for the handles would be about halfway b/ the board’s center and the rails. think that’s going to be a problem, having them like that at the board’s mid balance point? looking at wardog’s pix, it seems he has his further out to the rails but that seems like it’d be a stretch for my arms.
next up: questions about cheapo DIY options for paddles and pads …
Definitely do a pad. I know Jimmy made the top thicker than the first run, but you’ll get heel dents.
Cheapest way is to buy the material and stick it on yourself. I think the ding king just uses 3m spray cement.
As far as paddles go, you can get a wood one for about 200 bucks. A lot of people swear by them, but I like the carbon fiber. I’ve seen adequate paddles made from a top section of windsurfer mast, and a blade from a cheap kayak paddle, but they’re heavy
I was riding a 10′ long 29″inch wide 4 1/2″ thick custom epoxy 3 fin shaped by Ron House. I’m 6′2″ and weigh 205 lbs. This board is amazing. It is very stable and super loose in the surf. It surfs like a little fish. I also have an 11′6″ long 27″ wide Ron House custom that is a great board. Check out my website for pictures and videos. http://web.mac.com/tomtomproductions1/iWeb/tomtomproductions1/Welcome.html
Aloha,
Tom English
thanks again, bill. btw/ you know how wardog has those two leash plugs on the rear of his boards, using them to make a rope loop? is that just for windsurfing, do you think, or might they have some application for straight SUP as well?
Bill:
I am 6′6″ (78″)
Paddle length should be 84-86″
I can get a 84″ C4 paddle, usual price, and ship free with the board. An 86″ will cost me $70 more ($420..special order charge plus shipping). A wood JL is 85″ costs $200.
How critical is the paddle length?
Linter - You should check out the Jimmy deck pad. Maybe you can get a good deal on it from the shop you bought the board at. Did you get it from Wardog? The Jimmy pad has a raised outer edge for the standing area which allows you to brace your feet and get more stability. For $100 or so you’ll most likely appreciate it.
Another thing that helps w/ balance is booties. I know I look silly riding in Hawaii with booties but when I step on reef or walk on concrete it’s just such a nice feeling not getting cut. These Reef booties are so cool bc they are thin and I can feel the board w/ my toes. The big benefit is the grip. They grip the deck pad unreal. I rode for the first time without the booties and kept slipping off initially bc I was so used to the grip. I bought them from Real. http://www.realkiteboarding.com/index.cfm?page=detail&catID=526&productID=8717
The Ordonez Big Red also has the 2 leash plugs at the end. I thought it was cool to grab onto when needed.
wsurfn - I started off with the C4 paddle not cut at all. It ended up being something like 6″ too long. I didn’t notice the difference until I cut it and the difference is pretty dramatic. I like it a little longer, maybe 1-2″ for going downwind but at 6′, my 80″ paddle is sweet. You may also want to look at the quickblades. http://www.quickblade.com I have a Pop’s model for that and the Pohaku C4. The C4 has no give whatsoever so I can move faster but also get tired faster. The Quickblade has a little give which is easier on the joints and it’s lighter. I use the C4 in chest high or bigger surf and Quickblade in anything smaller.
Tom - I was just thinking that if my friend’s Ron House Laird that I’ve been riding was 29″ it would be perfect. Your board is thicker and 3 fins must be way better in the surf. How much was it? Is it heavy?
I have both the Quickblade and the Pohaku, and I prefer the Quickblade because you can paddle it all day. Also that little bit of flex seems to help in the surf when you lean on the shaft–it’s somehow more effective.
I think also though that I cut my Pohaku too short–one shaka over my head. For me the ideal length seems to be about eight inches over my head. I did a fair amount of experimenting to wind up with that, taping the handle in place and cutting 1/2 inch increments looking for the most comfortable length.
I haven’t seen the new JL pads, but Jimmy was pretty pleased with them. He’s a pretty pragmatic guy. $100 isn’t bad for a good pad. Nice thing about this sport–once you’ve bought all the stuff it’s really over.
I agree about the booties. My favorites are the Oneil Superfreak Tropicals. Very light, separate big toe for better balance, fits snugly and doesn’t hold water. Usually I start wearing them AFTER I’ve cut my feet to ribbons. I don’t care for them on waxed boards, but on mats they are wonderful. I also like to put some soft wax on the mat–it increases the grip hugely. I let it get hot in the sun and melt into the surface. Gecko feet.
Man, those paddles are getting expensive.
Bill - How thick is the sole of the Oneil booties? Can you feel the board or are they more like shoes? I agree, I only use them on boards w/ the pads.
I guess the pad may be more than $100 but you should be able to get a deal if you bought the board. See here:
http://www.realkiteboarding.com/index.cfm?page=detail&catID=590&productID=8883#
Naish is making a stand up paddle and board coming out soon. I think the paddle is supposed to be under $200 or so.
http://www.windsurfjournal.com/frontblocks/news/PaperView.asp?id_papers=3108&ID_BB_LANGUAGES=2
http://www.windsurfnsnow.com.au/images/windsurf_images/naish_paddle/naishpb-specs.pdf
The boot overall is 2mm but the sole is super thin. http://www.oneill.com/mens-products.php?sport=surf&categoryID=-1&typeID=7&seriesID=10&id=52
I like how tight they fit. Whatever water gets in escapes out the arch so they don’t balloon.
I know you can get the JL with the pad already on it.
The O’neill bootie soles are thin. Bare feet always will win for feel. I just got the new Reef booties from Real last month for windsurfing on nasty shorelines. Sole thickness is the same. I am hopeful they will hold up a little better.
A guy on a kneeboarding site says he’s had good luck w/ these fairly cheap EVA pads from Sports Authority: http://tinyurl.com/2m2jsp. For 30 clams, you get 9 interlocking 1/2″ pads, 24″x24″ each, that lock together to form a 6′ x 6′ square. a little razor work could probably result in an economical pad for SUP.
now my question is, is there a semi-permanent adhesive out there, if you want to try a pad w/out totally committing to it?
http://tinyurl.com/2m2jsp
darn that period.
Hmmm. I wonder if the pix showed up. Anyway, if not, perhaps cut and paste will work. One shows the yak paddles I have to work while saving up for a real SUP paddle; and one shows one of those paddles with a half-PVC shaft, which is undoubtedly too bendy to work, so I’ll be looking around for a sailboard mast. But my question is: which of the two paddle heads looks like it might work best? The Onno has a curve to it, the other does not.
And now I’m going to receed into the distance. I’ve blathered away too much here already. Trouble is, you guys are so helpful!
sheesh.
http://www.linter.org/paddle/paddle1.jpg
http://www.linter.org/paddle/paddle2.jpg
darn html.
and, now, seriously, I’m over & out!
I’ve heard that even cheap Yoga mats will work to some degree, though the source is a really goofy friend of mine. You can use 3M spray glue to mount them. Spray both surfaces librally, let dry, stick on.
Do you know if with the 3m spray glue you can take the mats off and get rid of the residue without heroic efforts?
Yes, there are a lot of solvents that will take it off. Generally you can peel up the mat if you let it get warm in the sun, then use a solvent to take it off. Acetone is the last resort since it will attack any paint. Try just detergent and a scrubber first. The longer it’s in place, the harder it is, but usually the problem is that it doesn’t hold strongly enough. If you want to REALLY keep it down use contact cement.
Got the Sports Authority pads. Very cushy but they seem a little thick at 1/2″. Too thick? Also, they don’t seem all that tractiony; but if you put on a little wax — thanks, Bill, for recommending that — they sticky up just fine. Now I’ve got to figure out how to cut em down neatly — that’s the real challenge.
Bill,
I am new to to SUP, but have been surfing for 10yrs+ and longboard quite a bit. I am 6′4″, 230lbs and I am having a difficult time deciding what size and type board to purchase. I have only recently tried a 11′x29.5″x4.5″ Ricky Carroll. The board floated me but seemed like it could have used just a bit more volume. The board had continuous modest rocker and a flat to vee bottom. All in all it surfed fairly well in knee highs, but didn’t seem to glide at all while paddling. I found that I had to keep the board moving in order to keep the board stable. Is this normal or the result of a undersized board? I was able to paddle the board well and only fell when trying to turn quickly for waves. I am concerned that going with a board that is too short will leave me constantly struggling, but on the other end of the coin I am also worried that I may not like the surfing characteristics of some of the larger (12′) boards like the Laird. Another consideration is the durability of a hand/machined shaped and glassed EPS or urethane board vs. the strength of a epoxy TUFlite, NSP or Surftech type board.
I mistakenly hit the rail of the Ricky Carroll board (not very hard either) with the paddle blade while turning the board and put a 2″ long x1/2″ deep ding. This has me thinking that a glassed construction boards may be inferior to Epoxy sandwiched Surftech type boards for paddle use, due to durability. After all at 4″+ the flex characterictics should not play an integral part to the boards performance.
Any way I want to know if anyone has any advice before i pull the trigger and buy a board?
My 2 cents.
Weight 208 lbs, 6′2. Been paddling one month with Laird and now Jimmy Lewis 11 footer. Age 53.
My views match Bill’s almost exactly when comparing these boards, except one minor point. For me, the Laird is more stable by a noticable difference.
I catch waves easier on the JL. I have more fun on the JL. The light weight (I think) makes some difference. The JL reacts better to weight shifts when trying to catch a wave. It also reacts quicker when you make a mistake with weight placement
It feels much smaller than the Laird, and much more fun. More sporty is the best way to describe.
This experience makes me think heavy custom boards might not be much fun.
By the way, I use a 10″ fin in my JL. Same for the Laird.
Knowing how these two boards compare, then reading Bill’s comments on how other boards compare to these, gives me a nice view on these others, without having to buy and try.
Thanks Bill.
well, got my jimmy-11 out for the first time today and messed around on it for about 20 minutes, which is when the thunder and lightning started. Knee paddling was no problem but there was a mighty wobbling of the legs when i got to my feet. But at least I was on my feet! And making headway! So what I know now, I think, is that I *can* do this even given my leg and balance issues. It’ll take time before I’m wave ready but that’s okay. I’m stoked! And I s’pose if I want to ride some wave while I’m getting my stand-up sea legs in order, I could always paddle in to some on my knees, canoe style.
Attached are links to a few pix. One shows my $5 yoga pad (I went with it over the Sports Authority pads, because it’s thinner and not as slick on the surface), which I glued down with 3M Super 90 spray glue, which I found out on a kneeboarding site is the adhesive of choice.
The other two pictures show a shoulder strap I rigged up. The first shot shows it in its Velcro-shut position. The other one shows it in its open, shoulder-ready position.
For the tie down points, I used stick-down EZ Plugs. By all accounts these things work great and stick like crazy. We’ll see. If they go, i just hope it’s not over cement!
http://www.linter.org/sup/lewis1.jpg
http://www.linter.org/sup/lewis2.jpg
http://www.linter.org/sup/lewis3.jpg
Don’t you guys think we’re going to need at least 2 boards? It’s really hard to get a big, stable board to surf well and vice versa. The more I do this in different conditions, I am convinced that I need a big, stable board for smaller waves and choppy conditions and a smaller, better surfing board for larger surf. I’ve been looking and trying a lot of boards looking for the perfect one but so far have not found it. Maybe the Jimmy 11′er will be the answer once I get mine this week and spend more time on it.
I know budgets may not allow that bc they are so darn expensive but that’s the conclusion I’m coming to. What do you guys think?